The Power of Healing in Community with Dr. Christine Coleman
— EPISODE 87 —
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Dr. Adia Gooden [00:00:05] Are you a high achieving professional BIPOC woman who is ready to claim your worth outside of the hustle? Are you ready to experience joy, peace, and contentment as you make an impact on the world without overextending yourself? Are you longing for a space that centers the experiences of women of color where you can practice leaning into the soft life without being expected to explain yourself or be responsible for other people? If you answered yes to these questions, I invite you to apply to join the Unconditionally Worthy Group Coaching Program. Here's what one of my former group coaching members, Felicia, had to say about how the program helped her.
Felicia [00:00:43] The program has encouraged me to put myself first and to actually think about what I wanted. That was another thing that came up for me. A lot of the times with the prompts and the modules, like, I don't know, because I never stopped to think about it. No one's ever asked me what I thought or what I felt about these particular scenarios. And that's been fun just discovering myself because it's like I originally started this program or with the thought or the attention to get back to myself. And the reality is, there was nothing to get back to because I'd never explored it. I don't know. So now it's just getting curious about what do I like? What do I want? How does this feel? And that's been incredibly helpful. And I'm excited for this new adventure to get to know myself.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:01:39] The next cohort starts the week of September 25th, 2023. Apply now, before spots fill up. I will personally review your application and invite you to join me for a call to discuss whether or not this program is right for you.
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Dr. Christine Coleman [00:01:58] This self-worth concept is crucial. It's essential, it's beautiful and necessary because we are in a place where I think we're really grabbing our power back. And I think it's beautiful, and it's not to be done by ourselves.
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Dr. Adia Gooden [00:02:16] Welcome to the Unconditionally Worthy Podcast. In this podcast, I will guide you on your journey to connect with the true source of your self-worth. Each week we'll discuss barriers to unconditional self-worth, the connection between self-worth and relationships, self-worth practices you can apply to your life. And how to use self-worth as a foundation for living courageously. I'm your host, Dr. Adia Gooden, a licensed clinical psychologist, dance enthusiast, and a dark chocolate lover who believes deeply that you are worthy unconditionally.
Hello and welcome to another episode of the Unconditionally Worthy Podcast. I'm recording this really way ahead of time. So it's May 2023. You're listening to this probably in fall 2023. When we started the podcast, I was like, maybe two weeks ahead. Like it would be real tight and close to the deadline. And now, because we're doing seasons and we've got a rhythm down, we are recording way ahead of time, which is amazing. So, shout out to my podcast management team, Crys & Tiana, they keep me on track. So, anyway, I'm recording this in the spring, getting ready for summer. Looking forward to kind of a relaxing summer break. I'm not necessarily taking the summer off, but definitely a slowdown and I'm really excited for the guest today.
So, Dr. Christine Coleman is a therapist. She's a marriage and family therapist. She does coaching with BIPOC women leaders, and she does DEI consulting with organizations. And it was a really great conversation. There's so much alignment in some of the work that we do, and it was great to hear her insights and her take. And she just shares really openly. We talk a lot about identity and roles and the challenges of being pulled in a lot of different directions and how we navigate that and still remember and claim the truth of who we are. So it's a great conversation. I know that you are going to get so, so much out of it. We talk a little bit about the power of group coaching and how much benefit it is to sort of heal in the context of a group.
If your interest is piqued. If you're compelled by our discussion, I'd love to hear from you. Let me know. Are you interested in applying for the Unconditionally Worthy Group Coaching Program? It's a magical space. It's a healing space, it's a transformative space. And what happens in that group just cannot happen in the context of individual coaching. And so the content might be similar, but the experience is very different and incredibly powerful. So I'd love to hear from you. If you're interested in the group coaching program, you can apply now. You can go to unconditionallyworthy.com/program. You'll learn all about the program and you can apply. And I look forward to seeing your application. Let's get into the show.
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I am so excited to welcome Dr. Christine Coleman to the podcast today. Dr. Christine Coleman is the Founder and CEO of POC Thriving, a private practice specializing in the intersection of mental health and diversity, equity, and inclusion. Dr. Coleman holds 15 years of clinical training, predominantly in service to marginalized communities. Dr. Coleman’s current practice prioritizes the psychological and emotional wellbeing of BIPOC professionals. She also supports companies and organizations with mental health, inclusivity, and belonging initiatives so they can better prioritize the psychological wellbeing and retention of employees, particularly those of color.
Dr. Coleman received the University of San Francisco’s “Living the Mission” award for her dedication to serving women and girls. Dr. Coleman is the Founder and Co-Executive Director of Sol Sisters Inc., a nonprofit with a mission to help women overcome societal barriers by providing educational and empowering experiences that promote personal and professional evolution. Dr. Coleman is an Executive Coach to women of color leaders and recently founded the Women of Color Thriving Collective, set to be the leading network for women of color leaders.
Dr. Coleman holds a B.S. in Psychology from Azusa Pacific University, a Master’s in Counseling Psychology from the University of San Francisco, a license to practice Marriage and Family Therapy in California, and a Ph.D in Marriage and Family Therapy from Eastern University. So welcome, welcome, welcome, Dr. Christine. I'm so glad to have you here today.
Dr. Christine Coleman [00:07:01] Thank you so much. Thank you for having me.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:07:02] You're welcome. So I'd love to start our question where I start all my conversations with guests, which is by asking you to share a bit about your own self-worth journey.
Dr. Christine Coleman [00:07:12] I love that question. I'm thankful that you're asking that because the clients I work with are very reflective, I think of me and my journey, and it is probably a reason why I'm driven to serve the people I serve. And so for me to be asked about self-worth is foreign not necessarily to say that negatively, but I think it's definitely a byproduct of the ways in which we as women of color in particular, find ourselves operating in the world as leaders, not just at work, but also in all aspects of our lives. And with that said, I think it's hard for even myself to lose sight of who am I and how do I continue to prioritize my self-worth? So this question's really important for me to reflect on as well as all of us who maybe hold similar life experiences. As for me, I think so much of my self-worth journey really lies in my self-confidence.
I think that a lot of my journey has really been about building and believing in myself and my self-confidence. So a lot of that for me has been tied to things like body image and my appearance. I've struggled with body image, weight, all kinds of these societal pressures that we find women, especially young women falling prey to. That has definitely been something that has been top of concern to me over the years. And it's hard when growing up. I know that we're on a better trajectory, but growing up it wasn't like that. I didn't see myself, I'm a Mexican Iranian woman. There are not a lot of people who represent what I represent and I am 5'8 and I just operated very differently in the world. It was very hard for me to belong. So when I didn't see myself reflected in outsiders, when I didn't really have a lot of guidance in terms of fitness and nutrition, that was very hard for me to understand what I am worth outside of what I look like.
And I think also growing up, I'm a tall girl. I also looked a lot older than I was most of my adolescence. And so that was just kind of an unexpected introduction into objectification of women and girls. And so with that said, it is just been a lot about my appearance, but then over time, especially as I've stepped into leadership roles with founding a nonprofit that I had zero nonprofit experience with, and just really feeling this call to help people and serve, and yet really being mindful to not fall into work and leadership as the majority of my identity. And so my self worth really in this phase of my life even though the appearance aspect has really been a long process of healing and discovery, something I pay a lot of attention to with my clients, especially because unfortunately, women from all backgrounds, especially women of color, are often objectified and sexualized in a number of ways often much more than other groups.
And so, with that said, I think in this phase, in combination of that longevity plus just really making space for who am I in this phase of my life. I'm 38 years old, I have a five and a three year old. I am often finding myself, defining myself in relation to the extension of myself to others. And it's difficult to deal with. It's easy to get lost in. So I'm really trying to find that balance and continuing to discover and unveil my self worth journey of who I am. Who am I? Do I know myself, not what I do, not what I'm good at, not who I serve, but who am I as an individual? It's something that is an ongoing process, but it's something that I'm continuously discovering about myself.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:10:42] Such a rich answer. I so appreciate it. I mean, I think, just starting with the body acceptance, body image, things that you navigated, right? I think so many of the listeners will resonate with that because we live in a world that constantly sends messages to women and girls especially about our bodies and what they should look like and what they shouldn't look like and what's acceptable and what's not acceptable. And there's so many messages, and some of them are societal and in advertisements. Some of them are from family and friends, right? Like, they can just really come from everywhere. And I think often because we tend to have a way in our society of individualizing the problem, people think, well, it must be me that I am feeling this way or I must be the problem.
And it's really like, no, it's really hard to navigate this world we're in as a teenager, as a young woman, even as an adult, right? And feel like I feel really confident about my body, right? It's challenging. And so I really appreciate that you're highlighting that you've navigated this, right? And I think we can often assume that other people don't deal with those challenges, right? Like that other people are not sort of struggling with the same things that we are struggling with. And so I appreciate you sharing that. And then I also appreciate you talking about sort of this dynamic of balancing the roles we play, the things we do in the world, which, we can be really passionate about. Right? So you talked about starting a nonprofit. I'm sure that's something that you're really passionate about that being a business owner and a business leader and a nonprofit leader and helping people. It's something that I'm sure is driven by passion, and we still can get lost in even those things that we love so much. And the same with motherhood, right? Like-
Dr. Christine Coleman [00:12:44] Gosh, yeah.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:12:45] Wanting to give to your kids and wanting to give them so much. And then I have felt like there's this tension between like, oh, I want my daughter to feel happy, to not be upset, to not, right? And it's like, okay, now I'm leaving the house to go do something fun. And she's throwing a little tantrum, right? So I went to the Lizzo concert a couple weeks ago and it was like, I'm on my way out and she's throwing a little tantrum, and it's like, part of me wants to be like, okay, I won't go. But then part of me now is like, no, you paid for the ticket. It's going to be fun. You're going to be better for it. She'll ultimately be better for it. And so there's a lot of tension that we should just inherently navigate as we're wanting to claim and create space for ourselves and wanting to show up in our professional lives and our personal lives in a way that feels good and aligned with our values.
Dr. Christine Coleman [00:13:38] Right? 100%. Everything you're saying resonates with me so much. We're stretched, we're stretched beyond sometimes, and yet somehow we make it happen. And I think the hard part is, many of us thrive off of that. And I think that that's cool. But I think also what I'm seeing, especially as a mental health professional, is that we're suffering, we're suffering to fulfill this persona of doing it all and having it all. And again, you read my bio, I'm definitely a go-getter. I love to accomplish, I love the accolades I've obtained, and I want to keep on going on that trajectory. And I'm also in a phase of my life where I'm recognizing that is not all there is to me. And if I keep on chasing that in exchange for my mental health, my emotional wellbeing, my physical health deteriorating, I really have some choices I need to make.
And I think that I'm realizing there's some that I might have to be adjusting as well. And maybe somebody listening out there is recognizing I might have to be adjusting in this phase of my life. And sometimes it comes in seasons. Sometimes we're stretched more than in others. Sometimes we recognize that is dependent on age or phase of life or the different roles that we obtain whether it's motherhood or a change in work or what have you. And so, yes, I'm so aligned with your experiences. I am guilt to achievement, to just finding that balance. It's really hard.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:15:10] Yeah. And I think we don't live in a society that slows down, right? We live in a country and a culture that is go, go go nonstop. I've always been struck when I've traveled to Europe, and I haven't traveled to Europe that many times, but when I have, I've saved up all my vacation days to take like two weeks in Europe, and then I'm trying to fit in three countries and five cities, right? Like, let's try to see everything because you got two weeks and you bump into other travelers. And European travelers are like, oh, we're on a one month holiday, we're on a two month holiday. And they just have the time, right? And it just strikes me even if you're in Spain, let's say, right?
And there's a siesta, right? Like there are two hours where everything shuts down. And so our culture is not that way, right? US culture is go, go, go. Don't take a break for lunch, work at the desk. Maybe you get your vacation days in, maybe you take a week vacation, right? And so in the midst of that, it is counter-cultural and challenging to say, okay, I'm going to intentionally step back or I'm going to intentionally stop doing these things. So for me, that looked like last year right before I had my baby, I closed my clinical practice. And there were a number of reasons that I did that. One of which was, it just wasn't feeling aligned for me anymore. But I also knew that once I had a baby, I was not going to have the capacity. I wasn't going to be able to do all of the things that I had been doing before, I just wasn't going to be able to do it.
And that felt uncomfortable, right? Because I'm usually someone like you, like adding things and doing more things. And so it's this challenge of like, my mind wants to do all the things, but then my inner wisdom knows if you try to do all the things, you're going to burn yourself out. You're going to get sick, you're going to be tired. And so you cannot do that. But it goes against the grain, it goes against culture and it also can have a feeling of loss and of like, oh, I can't do some of the things that I really want to do, or I'm excited to do, or I see other people doing because I'm in a different phase of life right now.
Dr. Christine Coleman [00:17:29] Yeah. I definitely felt that part of my life. A few years ago I was working as a school-based therapist here in the San Francisco Bay area. Got pregnant, my husband had this opportunity for us to go to Bermuda. That's a really small island. Now it's familiar. It's really beautiful. I highly recommend it. To go there because the headquarters of his then company were there and they asked him to go live there for a year.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:17:52] Wow.
Dr. Christine Coleman [00:17:53] And so we made the decision to go. I was in the middle of getting my doctorate, quit my job, was about to burst, and ended up having my daughter right before we left. So.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:18:02] Wow.
Dr. Christine Coleman [00:18:03] The first entry to motherhood living in boxes around this little bassinet. Like here we go off to another country. Don't know anybody, quit my job. I'm not connected to anything, especially, and in that phase of my life, I was in my early thirties and that was when I felt like I was just getting started.
And I had just [indiscernible 00:18:19], I was just getting my name out there and in beautiful organization and myself established as a professional outside of all the grad school I had done in the past. And so talk about identity shift, and in that time it was really just about me and my baby, me and my dissertation. Another not so great baby.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:18:39] Gosh.
Dr. Christine Coleman [00:18:40] And just really experiencing a different experience in my life, but also a different relationship with myself. And I think that that's exactly whether you move abroad or not, we are faced with these different chapters of our lives where we get to meet a new version of ourselves that can be really beautiful and that can also be really scary and shake up our whole world. And the other part that I think is really important is it also communicates to others that I don't know this version of her either.
So we see friendships changing, we see changes in our romantic relationships. We see changes even with our own family members who expect all these things of us. But all of a sudden I'm realizing I actually can't show up for you the way that I used to because I have a whole child now, or I live far away now. And that's really hard for outsiders, especially those close to us to adjust to. And so, yeah, it is really hard, I think to reach a place where we think we understand and know ourselves so well. And then something changes whether it's planned or unplanned. Right now I'm in the midst of a really hard chapter in my life because I have two small kids and I also have my mom who's really sick. And my uncle who helped raise me, he's also incredibly sick with some really, really life-threatening illnesses.
And I'm an only child and have a single mom. And so, I am very much American, but I find, especially when we talk about culture, very Latina, very Latinx expectations of me there for elders to show up for elders as much as I possibly can. And I love to do it, and I wish I could do it all the more, but it's hard when I'm like, I'm also establishing my own life and I have these children I need to attend to and my family and all the things going on. And so I know that we're not always prepared for this. I don't think at 38 years old, I quite expected this to happen at this phase. But I also know there really is no plan all the time. Sometimes these, again, illnesses unexpected come and we are faced with ourselves in a really crucial way. To recognize what can I give, what do I need?. And so really important not just one-time questions or one-time forms of questions, but checking in with ourselves over and over and over again. And I imagine that even though that might reach its highs and lows, it's something that I think we frequently have to do moving forward as we continue to go through adulthood.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:21:02] I'm sorry that your mom is sick and your uncle is as well. And I just imagine the sort of mental and emotional load could being concerned about them on top of the actual caregiving load is really heavy. And I think that's something else that will really resonate with listeners. And I think in particular BIPOC listeners, women of color, right? That often we are carrying these extra loads and I think we carry these extra loads in our family and our community. And then I think we also often are doing extra labor at work. And then there's this disconnect between people at work understanding that we may also have these extra loads with our family outside of work, right? Like you may have your own children, but even if you don't have your own children, right? Like the cultural expectations, right?
You mentioned, in Latinx families certainly, and black families and lots of other BIPOC communities, right? Is that you take care of family members, you take care of elders. If that's financially, if that's in time, in energy. And so that can be an extra load that then, on top of work. And so I'm bringing this into sort of the work professional space because I know that you work a lot with women of color leaders, with companies that are trying to increase belonging. And so I'm curious about some of the challenges that you see BIPOC folks, women of color experiencing as they navigate corporate environments or even nonprofit and university environments as they're sort of navigating the different worlds and the different pressures.
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Are you a high achieving professional BIPOC woman who has achieved success through hard work and hustle? You've shown up, busted barriers and challenged low expectations, and now you're tired. You're ready for a space where you will be encouraged, supported, and where your soul will be nourished? I created the Unconditionally Worthy Group Coaching Program for you. This program offers the space you are looking for. In this curated group of just 10 BIPOC women. I will coach and guide you to embrace your unconditional self-worth. This curriculum-based group coaching program is grounded in my 15 years of experience as a clinical psychologist, my research and expertise from writing and publishing a book on black women's mental health, and my own journey of overcoming perfectionism, overworking, and people pleasing to embrace and live from the truth that I am unconditionally worthy. Here's what one of my former group coaching members, Tony, had to say about the program.
Tony [00:23:50] To me, it's the best investment one can make in themselves. So do it. Don't let finances hamper you. Because we spend money anyway. It's the best investment in yourself.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:24:01] Apply now before spots fill up. The next cohort starts the week of September 25th, 2023. I will personally review your application and invite you to join me for a call to discuss whether this program is right for you.
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Dr. Christine Coleman [00:24:22] We are already off to, I think, a conversation about ourselves. And this is not lost on or foreign to folks I work with. And I'm sure that you work with an encounter as well. There's so many similarities and yet we're also different because there's diversity amongst groups of color, women of color in particular. And so to think about the commonalities that we share. I know that Latinx communities are not the only ones who have this call to serve others, especially our elders. That happens across cultures as well. And also I know that our communities are also very different and they're nuanced. And even if we belong to a certain community of color, it doesn't mean that we're all the same. And so I'm seeing how that transfers into the workplace a lot. Really kind of continuing to do my own research and lean into what are the things I'm seeing that are common across the people I serve who identify as BIPOC or women of color.
And also what are the differences. And I think across the board there continues to be a consistent tug to over perform, to continue to show up. And again, I know that we live, like you mentioned and framed it so beautifully, that we live in a society generally this American culture that's ingrained in us to a degree. But when you pile on top the need to prove, right? That we deserve to be there, that we're cognizant enough to be aware of what is needed. We're smart enough, talented enough, that is something that my clients that I encounter carry every day, all day. And how does that show up? That shows up in being overly available. That shows up in working ourselves to the point of being in the hospital. I've had clients go on medical leave not just for the overwork, but also some of the discrimination and flat out racism and sexism that they've experienced as well.
It's really, really serious. And I think sometimes we just applaud ourselves as a society for diversifying, but we're not prepared to actually know what diversifying what in terms of mental health impacts what is actually needed. And so that is why this work is very important to me. And I know you and so many others that DEI initiatives, DEIB initiatives are crucial. They're necessary. And are we actually prepared for the mental health implications that come with that? Do you know how to interact as a company organization while identifying person, a male, people who represent privilege? Are you prepared to have these encounters to talk to people based on their backgrounds and personal experiences? Are you prepared to not just say, yay, we look good because we're a colorful, diverse team, but we're actually tending to the mental and emotional adjustments that people need to fall into your workplace culture?
And better yet, is your workplace culture adapting and adjusting to what the needs are? And the representation is that this company is continuously changing? That is something I'm seeing that is really hard for companies to do because systemically capitalism is very much rooted in white supremacy and is very much a long lasting system. We're chipping away at it, but it's a process. It's a process. So belonging is huge, or lack of belonging is continuingly something I'm working with clients with? Really helping understanding clients and folks who represent a number of backgrounds understand what we bring into the workplace is not necessarily solely work. We're bringing in what happens in our personal lives like illnesses, like being exhausted because we don't have 10 people in our community or our villages to help us with our kids. We're doing a lot of this as women alone or with very little help.
We are paying really expensive childcare for those of us who are parents if we need to be there. We're also carrying in societal impacts that are tied to vicarious trauma. it's really hard. I have a lot of clients who are like, I'm a black woman. I'm a brown woman. I'm a person who was just exposed to somebody being tortured and killed on when I was just scrolling through my friends' updates, and then I'm exposed to that and you want me to go back to work? You want me to perform and show up? Just as everything is okay. And in the midst of that, everybody else seems to be quite all right because they're not impacted in the same way. So to be experiencing societal challenges and traumas and then be expected to come into a workplace who's so proud of themselves for being diverse, but yet is not really taking on, like, what does that actually mean?
Are you making space? Are you highlighting without being weird, without crossing a line of like, how are you, you know really genuinely tapping into the humanity of all of the people who are represented in your organization. So there's a lot, there's societal stuff. This is actually the framework that I have built out for the work I do with my coaching clients. We focus on our personal relationships, on our relationships to ourselves, our relationship to work, and our relationship to society.
So as I started, it's really important for me to remember I'm a whole person and I represent a lot of things, not just work, not just motherhood, but even in the midst of our relationships that are external. So what I really work on helping clients do is bringing it back to the, what I think is essential is ourselves, knowing ourselves, trusting ourselves, healing ourselves, empowering ourselves. It's really, really hard to do. But I think this work is a part of the healing process, is part of gaining control back over ourselves that we can really know I'm in charge of my life. I get to call the shots I'm not solely tied to and privy to all of the demands over me.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:30:07] Yeah. I love that. I love everything that you shared and wanting to touch back to what you said earlier, which is asking yourself, what do I need? What can I give? And I think those two questions are so powerful in this kind of context and this framework that you're laying out that you offer to women of color leaders. Because often it feels like if other people need something from me, I just have to give them, I have to sacrifice and ignore my own needs, right? And we may be in a situation where at a given moment, we may need something that we cannot give to ourselves right now, or it may not be possible. And just even the act of knowing as you're saying, knowing yourself, knowing what you need, and then also knowing what do I have the capacity to give right now?
Maybe my capacity is to donate a few dollars, right? Maybe my capacity is volunteering, maybe my capacity is having a conversation with someone who needs some support and mentoring. Maybe my capacity is linking them up with somebody else who can be helpful, right? Like, having those check-in points and acknowledging that like, we are also worthy of our time and our energy, right? And that we needed to be included in the mix in the framework and the context of what we're doing and how we're operating. Because so many of us are socialized to just be giving to everyone else. So I wanted to touch on that and I also just wanted to connect and I really appreciate your acknowledgement, which is something I also try to do of like, okay, there's societal stuff, right? Like there's cultural stuff, there's systemic stuff that needs to be addressed and that impacts us.
And there's also things that we can do for ourselves, right? And it's both of those things. And so I really appreciated you sort of highlighting that dynamic. And I think it's important for us to remember and acknowledge that often the overworking and the overperforming of BIPOC folks comes from, starting when you're a kid, getting the message probably from your family. You got to work twice as hard. You got to work three times as hard. And that there is reality in that, right? Like that we can then see, a coworker who's white not getting the same questioning or their work being accepted at a different level than ours is, right? Or maybe we saw a classmate getting that same experience when we were growing up. I remember in high school, there was a teacher who had a favorite student. I went to all girls schools, a white girl.
And she was a great student. Like, don't get me wrong, she wasn't a bad student, but I sort of joked around, I was like, I wonder if she turned in my paper right with her name on it, and I turned in her paper with my name on it. Like, what would the grades be? And my inkling was, we might get to, you know what I mean? Like, I might still get the same B plus that I could not seem to overcome. And she might get an A, right? I think we've also experienced the standards can be different, right? And so I think it's this challenge of how do we own for ourselves, our truth, our worth, our value, and what we contribute so that we at least, even if we're navigating what I call sort of a critical context or critical environment where there is bias and racism and sexism and all of the other isms, how do we at least get clear on who we are and what we bring and the value that we offer, even if everyone in the environment doesn't recognize that?
Dr. Christine Coleman [00:33:52] Yeah. Oh, that's a really good question. I think it's really important that you highlighted that. We're exposed to the realities of the systemic challenges really young. And they don't have to be explicitly said. I think we see it in the modeling. We see it in the upbringing of folks who are immigrants here. We see how people kind of are already othered how you're assimilating, right? We learn whether you're an immigrant or not, I think we notice that our families maneuver the way that they might say side comments or even just some body language, and then even some legitimate outcomes. We're just like that. This makes no sense. Why is that? And then we start to, over time it becomes unveiled of why, and it's really unfair. And then sometimes I'm also cognizant that families have these conversations really early because they have to out a survival and protection of themselves and their families. I just wanted to highlight and thank you for acknowledging your experience and that this starts really, really early, maybe earlier for some more than others. And now I lost my train of thought. Can you repeat the question because I lost it off.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:35:01] Oh gosh. Do I remember what the question was? I think what I was saying is how important it is to own our worth and own our gifts, our strengths, the value of what we contribute, even if the places and spaces that we're working in don't fully recognize it.
Dr. Christine Coleman [00:35:20] Yeah. Thank you for that. So I really find that affinity groups, especially in the workplace, but even outside of it, are really important for us. I think that it is important for us to find safety and belonging and confidence in groups where we do feel seen. There's a term you might be familiar with called homophily, right? Homophily essentially is we as human beings are attracted to sameness. It's very like internalized. It's a innate attraction that we have. It's where we feel like that person looks like me. That person sounds like me. I'm going to gravitate towards them. So even though I strongly believe that diversifying DEIB initiatives are essential, I also recognize that as human beings across backgrounds, we tend to gravitate towards that, which is familiar. So this work of diversifying this work of getting to know one another is actually has to be very conscious work.
We have to shift ourselves and shake ourselves out of that. And sometimes it's not appearance based. Sometimes it's, oh, I learned through a brief conversation. The X person is a parent. We bond off of having kids who are the same ages or we bonded off of liking the same things. That it's not always first glance. Many times it is. But that also helps inform us that, okay, I have to be mindful, thoughtful about shifting or shaking out of this place, because it makes sense. We as human beings are gravitated towards sameness. With that said, I think that there is also power and beauty, especially if we represent communities that have experienced systemic oppression. There is a call to bonding and finding groups where you can be yourself, where you can just kind of lay and just breathe and say, I just need to be vulnerable and be held and be myself.
The groups that I focus on and that I hold, especially in my group coaching are women of color, but across backgrounds. And some people really love that. And I also acknowledge that some folks are like, I want a Latinx specific group. I want a group that is specific to black women or API women. I totally understand that and I celebrate that. And I also think there's a way for us to, even within the large umbrella of being women of color, that we can find sameness and also recognize the differences and also listen to each other in that way. The caveat that I want to say with that, however, which I'm sure that you would agree with, is sometimes in these affinity groups, we tend to do what is called trauma bonding., because so much of our alliance is based on the traumatic experiences that we've had.
And so I think that with the celebration of community and trust, I think it's also important to add that we have to be very cautious of not solely bonding off of the terrible things that we have experienced. We can talk about them because we need those spaces. And what's your favorite ice cream? Where do you like to go? Tell me about your family. Tell me about other parts of you. Because again, like we started with our whole people and even our traumas can feel definitive of who we're and how we navigate the world. And sometimes are tied to society. Sometimes it's tied to something different or personal that happened to us. But we are not this cloud of whatever has happened to us or whatever the world says we are, we are ourselves. And I think this self-worth concept is crucial. It's essential. It's beautiful and necessary because we are in a place where I think we're really grabbing our power back. And I think it's beautiful and it's not to be done by ourselves. And that I think is the question of who do I trust? Where do I feel like I can be my whole self? I often say the saying, where can I take my cape off?
We walk around just feeling like we have to be superheroes all day. Putting out that fire, solving that problem, helping that person. It's so much, it's so much. And so who are the people? Where are the places you can identify racism? I'm throwing this thing off. Y'all just see me. I'm going to vent, I'm going to talk, I'm going to laugh. I want to kick my feet up. I want to take this hair down. I want to do me, and you know me fully and I can trust that you see me. And I don't have to put on a facade. I don't have to be asked of anything. I'm just here. Enough.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:39:37] Yeah. Yeah. I love that you're sort of mentioning the power of healing and connection and the power of claiming who we are beyond sort of our experiences. And that's often what I talk about is sort of our self-worth is we were born with it and can get covered over by experiences and conditions that we've been told to put on our worth and all of these other things. And so it's really about sort of a shedding and an uncovering that helps us to connect, reconnect to the truth of who we're, tap into our power. And I think that also related to what you're saying, which is like, we aren't our experiences and we also aren't our roles. We aren't all of these external things. And those can be things that we do identify with and feel really strongly about.
It could be things that we don't want someone to put on us, but we are more than any of those things. And so it's like connecting to yourself as a human. And I think a big part of that is being in community. And sharing and bringing all of yourself and having those spaces in places where you can be your true authentic self. It's part of the reason, you mentioned you do group coaching, I do group coaching, and often when I'm talking to people, when I'm talking to women, it's, I don't know about the group, right? Like I'm kind of nervous about the group, right? Like that's often this apprehension. And I think it's because we aren't used to safe healing spaces that are in community. And we think, okay, the only way to be safe is one-on-one behind closed doors with an individual therapist who will not be allowed to tell anything, right?
Like, we sort of imagine this worst case scenario. But what the women in my group find and tell me again, again, is that the group is one of their favorite parts of the program because they experience not being alone and they experience not being the only one. And they experience celebrating each other and their wins. And it's just such a beautiful thing that just doesn't happen in individual coaching or therapy. And that's not to say that those spaces aren't important because they are, but there just really is something powerful when you are healing and doing this growth work in community and in connection with other people.
Dr. Christine Coleman [00:41:58] Right? Oh my gosh, yes. That is terrifying for many of us to step into a space like that. And I've found it's probably one of my clients' just ultimate favorite experiences is to be in that space. You get to find that you're not alone, that you're, not the only person who feels or experiences these things. And even though people show up in our programs, I'm sure yours as well, to serve themselves. I think what is happening is also finding ways to show up for others, but in a way that feels collaborative. A lot of times I think that where we get exhausted, burned out, and even a bit resentful, is that there's a lot asked of us and not a lot return to us. And return doesn't mean that, I talked about this other day with a group of mine.
Sometimes we sense because many of us are, especially women and women of color in leadership roles, there's a part of us that thrives off of giving, it feels good, it feels fulfilling. And so with that said, we are giving, but it's really hard for us to ask for something in return. And there's also a sense if you ask somebody for something, that you have to be ready to offer them something back. Which essentially transactional. And so a lot of the teaching that I think we have to learn is asking for help or even help is not always a transactional process. If we can, there's certain situations I think especially working within corporations, and even in a nonprofit setting, I'm finding we can build relationships and collaboration across how can I support you?
I need support. And this way is beautiful and I think necessary a lot of times. But what I am saying is that when it comes to our personal wellbeing and our personal relationships, asking for help is really hard because we think that we have to do something back to get help them in return. And it's really hard just sitting in receiving from many of us. So I think what happens in these group spaces that's really beautiful is I'm showing up first and foremost for myself. I'm in community with trusted like-minded people, and I also feel a renewed sense of receiving, but also giving in a way that feels in control and good for me. I know that we're all showing up organically, authentically with such similar needs and maybe some different ones. But at the end of the day, I think it's the opportunity to retrain ourselves to know what is asking for help, what is receiving help? What times is transactional necessary? What times is it just, I'm sitting in a season of receiving and I'm okay with that. That is enough. I deserve that.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:44:44] Yeah. I love that. I think so often, and I certainly have fallen into this in the past, us sort of high achievers end up in these one-sided relationships, right? Where we are sort of the always the givers and the never the receivers. And for me growing up and in my early adulthood that looked like discomfort with asking, right? I still sort of get uncomfortable when it's time to ask and discomfort with receiving and feeling. And so then you set up this dynamic, right? And you're trained as a marriage and family therapist, so you know this well, which is we sort of can create these relationship dynamics that then people expect it, right? So it's like if you are always the giver and then there's somebody who's always the receiver, unfortunately, it's not always as simple as being like, hey, can you help me, right?
Because this dynamic has been set, right? And you certainly, it is changeable, but often we get in relationship with people who expect to receive all the time. And so then we get frustrated if we are sort of assuming that they should just jump in and know our needs without us asking for them. That's a big thing, right? Like people should just anticipate that I need help or that whatever. And so then we have these dynamics and I think what you're highlighting is that the group is an opportunity to have a different experience, right? It's an opportunity to practice taking up space, right? And often it's easier to say, okay, well this therapy session is my space, but in a group, people are often like, well, I don't want to take too much space and I don't want to talk too much.
And it's like, can you step in, can you let me manage the time and manage the space? And you take up the space you need and you get this sort of experience of not everybody is taking up 20 minutes every session, right? But one day someone may need 30 minutes of time and someone else may need 10. And that it evolves in this natural way as you're saying, as people are showing up for themselves and sharing their experiences. And then people get to hear, wow, you sharing and asking for coaching on this was so helpful to me. And it's like, oh, me asking for what I need and receiving didn't just benefit me. It also benefited these other people in the group, right?
And so it does sort of as you're highlighting, evolve our sense of giving and receiving beyond the transactional, beyond the zero sum, beyond like the scarcity of there's only so much time and resources and into more of an abundant, generative, creative free flowing framework, which is really, if we kind of think about, I think our ancestors, like that's how they lived life, right? It wasn't so transactional. It was, okay, you show up with your gifts and I show up with my gifts and we all bring it together and magic happens that we may not be able to explain in a one plus one equals two kind of framework.
Dr. Christine Coleman [00:47:39] Absolutely. Oh, I love that you brought that ancestral aspect to this because so much of our experiences over generations have changed and we have assimilated and acculturated to this way of being, and some parts of it are really beautiful and awesome, and it's probably allowed for us to accomplish so many things and many parts, as I said earlier, and I hear you saying as well, are harming us. And to call in what I do often with my coaching and therapy clients to call in our indigenous practices, our ancestors to this work in combination with who we are now and the type of environments that we navigate is really powerful, really essential. So many of us have lost those roots. So many of us honor them, but don't know how to combine them with our current lifestyles and exposures.
So slowing down our spiritual practices, our ancestors and tapping into our histories and generations past are really beautiful. They can be incredibly healing and they can be incredibly restorative as well. So thank you for mentioning that because an essential part of our process, so many of the things, especially in mental health, are rooted in euro practices in western culture. And so what I do a lot with my clients is tell me more. I don't know everything. I prioritize those aspects of my clients in the practice, in the work. And so you teach me, you tell me, you bring in parts of you that are important for us to do this work holistically as with a broader picture of you, and we can maybe start to find some opportunities to integrate those in the way that you operate in this current part of your life.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:49:25] I love that. I really do. As we wrap up, I'm wondering if you would be willing to share maybe one of your favorite wellness practices that you use in your own life or that you recommend to the clients and the women that you serve. If you could share that with us and the audience can sort of take it away and try it out.
Dr. Christine Coleman [00:49:50] Yes. Yes. It's actually something I do in my coaching program. It's an executive coaching program called Women of Color Thriving. We start off the first week with looking at our identity, understanding ourselves, and again, much of our conversation today about all the different roles that we play. And so I call it the identity pie and it's much like a pie chart. And I have my clients, I do this in therapy with my therapy clients as well. I have folks draw a circle and then identify the different roles and parts of their identities. It's their personal identities. I do this work as well with our intersectional identities. I want to focus for this moment on the personal because this allows folks to really look at themselves again with all of the parts of them. And some of them find, oh my gosh, I am very much imbalanced.
I didn't really know until now how much this slice takes up so much of me. Wow, I used to be so into art or I used to move my body so much or whatever, and it's not even on this chart anymore. Or it's a small sliver. And I think that doing that creates awareness and even more so what I do is I have clients over the 12 weeks adjust those slices if you'll to reflect what it is that they want in their lives. And part of the work, doing that, again, in group or with a coach or with a therapist or what have you, a professional of some sort that you select helps hold you accountable, helps hold you in support to be able to make the adjustments you want over your life. Because so much of this is, again, I am tied to, and it's kind of beholden to other things, other people.
And again, even just so many like boss women that I've encountered, I'm like, how have you, you seem so put together in control of things I hear all the time too. And it's like, yeah, but so much of me is feeling lost in the relationships, lost in the priorities to others versus me. So to do this chart activity I think really helps us become aware, reflect, and then also gain some of our power and control over how much we want to actually contribute to others and how much we need to pour back into ourselves. Can I add one more?
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:51:54]Yeah, sure.
Dr. Christine Coleman [00:51:55] That's one for me. I know that this is something that my daughter did not create, but she's fine and she's in a wonderful school. Another day she came back to me and was teaching me all these breathing exercises that she learned. I'm like, you're in transitional kindergarten, this is awesome that you're already learning.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:52:10] Amazing.
Dr. Christine Coleman [00:51:55] I did not have that growing up. And she taught me to, which I sure I have heard of, but it was really beautiful seeing it from a five-year-old's eyes who's in the midst of learning how to regulate her emotions and all the things. And it reminded me, oh my gosh, these are so easy and practical and you can't see me. I'm putting air quotes because I know it's not always easy, but they're tangible tools that we can include. And one is a rainbow breath. So she and I do inhale and if you could see my finger, kind of a rainbow arch inhale, hold, exhale, inhale, exhale. We do that sometimes when maybe we're both feeling a little dysregulated., we'll do that together. And then she also taught me box breath, which I know is familiar to many, which is inhale.
You draw a box and up and over and sometimes you might not be able to do those things when you're in your office or maybe around people you might feel a little funny, but whatever you can do to draw attention to your breath, maybe incorporate things for those who are listening who have families or children or what have you. Incorporating these as this is what we do as a family. This is what we do as people, this is normal, this is a part of the way we take care of each other. Do you need a minute? Can I help you? Can I do this with you?
And sometimes I think what we're learning too is like our kids can also kind of call us out and say, you might need a minute to breathe, mama, or what have you. But I think it's just really powerful that our kids are teaching us a lot, are teaching us. A lot of this is in the home and I think can really be wonderful modeling for those around us if we want them to. But mostly I want to communicate, these are for ourselves to use for us and taking care and pouring into our own selves.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:53:54] Yeah, I love that. I love both of those things. The breathing, right? Which is regulates our nervous system. It's so easy to be rushed and stressed and pulled in a lot of different directions and that can put our nervous system on edge. I know. I feel that more frequently than I'd like. And taking time to breathe deeply, to take walks, to do simple things really can help soothe our nervous systems and it makes a big difference. And then I also love the pie exercise, right? It's like taking time to reflect, like where is your time and energy going? What identities and roles are taking up more space? And is that intentional? Do you want to re-shift? Is that in this period of my life that's going to be the reality and how do you make sure that you rebalance?
And so I love that sort of creating a picture then allows for choice and intention which I think is really powerful. So I feel like we could talk for hours. There's so much alignment in terms of how we think and what we do. And so it's just been a real joy having you on the podcast, Dr. Christine. And I know that people are going to want to learn more about you and connect with you further. So will you please share how people can find you and connect with you?
Dr. Christine Coleman [00:55:13] Absolutely. Well, thank you. This has been such a pleasure and it is just been such a rich conversation, so thank you so much. Yes. I would love for y'all to connect with me. I'm on Instagram @drchristinecoleman. Same on LinkedIn. It's @drchristinecoleman. You can just search that there. My website, same thing. drchristinecoleman, if you're interested in learning more about my nonprofit called Sol Sisters Inc. On Instagram, we are @solsistersorg. So I would love to stay connected with you. Please, please do not hesitate to reach out.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:55:45] Wonderful. Thank you so much for your wisdom. I appreciate it.
Dr. Christine Coleman [00:55:49] Thank you.
[cheerful music starts]
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:55:50] Thanks for joining me this week on the Unconditionally Worthy Podcast. Make sure to visit my website, dradiagooden.com and subscribe to the show on iTunes so you'll never miss an episode. You can also follow me on social media at Dr. Adia Gooden. If you loved the show, please leave a review on iTunes so we can continue to bring you amazing episodes. Lastly, if you found this episode helpful and know someone who might benefit from hearing it, please share it. Thanks for listening and see you next episode.
[cheerful music ends]
This episode was produced by Crys & Tiana and the music is by Wataboi.
Cali by Wataboi https://soundcloud.com/wataboi
Creative Commons — Attribution 3.0 Unported — CC BY-SA 3.0
Music promoted by FDL Music https://youtu.be/ZdQI7WQWi_g
Do you feel alone or like you’re “the only one” that has gone through what you’ve gone through? Do you not feel seen when talking to the people in your life? Does the term “group coaching” make you want to run for the hills? If so, this episode is for you.
In this episode of Unconditionally Worthy, I welcome Dr. Christine Coleman, a Licensed Therapist, Speaker, Executive Coach, Consultant, and Founder/CEO of POC Thriving, a private practice specializing in the intersection of mental health and diversity, equity, and inclusion.
Today, Christine and I are talking about the power of healing in community and why group environments, like group coaching, are uniquely beneficial for healing. We discuss the benefits of affinity groups (in and out of the workplace) as well as the major challenges BIPOC folks are currently experiencing in corporate and academic spaces. Christine also shares insights from her own self-worth journey as a Mexican-Iranian woman navigating body image, self-confidence, motherhood, and leadership.
You are a whole person.
In any journey, but particularly in your self-worth journey, it’s important to remember that you’re a whole person with many intricate parts. Your self-worth is not defined by your occupation, your experiences, your trauma, or even what your parents tell you.
“It’s really important for me to remember I am a whole person and I represent a lot of things, not just work, not just motherhood,” Christine says. “What I really work on helping clients do is bringing it back to, what I think is essential, is ourselves. Knowing ourselves, trusting ourselves, healing ourselves, empowering ourselves. It’s really, really hard to do, but I think this work is part of the healing process. It’s a part of gaining control back.”
Do I really need to join a group?
Yes, you’re a whole person who’s capable of healing, but “it’s not to be done by ourselves,” Christine says. Just as community helps us live longer, it helps us live happier and healthier.
Christine emphasizes the importance of affinity groups, in and out of the workplace. An affinity group is a group of faculty and staff linked by a common purpose, ideology, or interest. These groups enable us to feel safety, belonging, confidence, and to feel seen for who we are.
As humans, we’re attracted to sameness. Thus, while DEIB (Diversity, Equity, Inclusion, and Belonging) initiatives are essential in every workplace, it’s also beneficial to have spaces where people of similar backgrounds, ethnicities, genders, etc. can gather, connect, and heal in community.
With that said, it’s important to be aware of the potential for trauma bonding in affinity groups. You should be cautious about solely bonding over the traumatic experiences you’ve had, as that can lead to more trouble down the road. Even though your traumas can feel definitive of who you are and the place you have in the world, you are so much more than your traumas. You are a whole person who needs community.
Where can you take your cape off? Where can you feel safe to talk about your traumas and your success stories and the mundane details of life? Who can you talk to?
If you don’t have an answer or you’re looking for a stronger, more like-minded community, consider group coaching! In a group coaching setting, you won’t feel so alone anymore. You won’t feel like the only one. You get to experience celebrating each other’s wins, which is a powerful driver that keeps you going. You also get to show up for others in a way that’s collaborative, not transactional or draining.
It may be a terrifying step to take, you might be resistant, but both Christine’s clients and the women in the Unconditionally Worthy Group Coaching Program describe group coaching as their favorite space to be in. This sense of community is truly life-changing for so many people, regardless of where you come from or what you’re going through.
Community heals.
Healing Benefits of Community & Group Coaching:
Decreased feelings of loneliness and/or feeling like you’re “the only one”.
Opportunities to show up for others in collaborative ways, without it feeling transactional.
A safe space to be mindful, reflect on your experiences, process your thoughts and emotions, and feel seen.
Insights and advice from people who have been through similar experiences as you.
Increased drive and motivation to be your best self and put what you learn into practice.
Opportunities to celebrate your wins and have them recognized in a positive setting.
Resources Mentioned:
Craving a community to heal with? The next cohort of the Unconditionally Group Coaching Program starts September 25th, 2023! Apply now to secure your spot: www.unconditionallyworthy.com/program
About Christine Coleman (she/her):
Dr. Christine Coleman is the Founder and CEO of POC Thriving, a private practice specializing in the intersection of mental health and diversity, equity, and inclusion. Dr. Coleman holds 15 years of clinical training, predominantly in service to marginalized communities. Dr. Coleman’s current practice prioritizes the psychological and emotional wellbeing of BIPOC (Black, Indigenous, people of color) professionals. Dr. Coleman also supports companies and organizations with mental health, inclusivity, and belonging initiatives so they can better prioritize the psychological wellbeing and retention of employees, particularly those of color.
To connect further with Christine Coleman:
Visit her website: https://www.drchristinecoleman.com
Join Sol Sisters: https://www.solsisters.org
Follow her on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/drchristinecoleman
Follow Sol Sisters on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/solsistersorg
Connect with her on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/drchristinecoleman
This episode was produced by Crys & Tiana.
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