How to Heal from Workplace Bullying with Zenica Chatman

Feb 21

Written By Adia Gooden

— EPISODE 70 —

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Zenica Chatman [00:00:00] That trauma moves with you. And so I had to go through my own process of, well, how do I get my confidence back? How do I get the sparkle back? How do I bring the Black Girl Magic back? And that was a process.
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Dr. Adia Gooden [00:00:17] Welcome to the Unconditionally Worthy Podcast. In this podcast, I will guide you on your journey to connect with the true source of your self-worth. Each week we'll discuss barriers to unconditional self-worth, the connection between self-worth and relationships, self-worth practices you can apply to your life, and how to use self-worth as a foundation for living courageously. I'm your host, Dr. Adia Gooden, a licensed clinical psychologist, dance enthusiast, and a dark chocolate lover who believes deeply that you are worthy unconditionally.
Hello and welcome to another episode of the Unconditionally Worthy Podcast. On today's episode, we are talking about something that I think far too many of us go through and experience, and that is experiencing a toxic workplace culture. Specifically my guest today, Zenica Chatman, experienced workplace bullying and really went through trauma because of it, because of the bullying she experienced. You might not experience bullying in the workplace specifically, but too many of us spend a lot of time in toxic workplaces, and we talk about some of the signs and signals that you may be experiencing a traumatic work environment, as well as some of the ways it's important to cope with that and move forward from it, and heal from it. So if you are experiencing a challenging work experience, work environmental situation, you're definitely going to want to listen to this episode.
It helps you to understand that you are not the problem, and we talk about how it's so important to understand that you're worthy in the midst of all of that, because that helps you to come through without losing sight of the truth of who you are. This is a really powerful episode. Zenica shares her own personal story, which is moving and relatable. And so you're going to want to dive in and listen to the full episode, and I'd love for you to share a rating or review. So if you find this episode helpful, if you find the podcast helpful, you can really help me help the podcast and support the podcast by sharing a review or a rating on Apple Podcasts or Spotify podcasts. This helps other people to find the episode. So I would sincerely, sincerely appreciate it and let us know what you think. Let's get into the show.
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I'm really excited to welcome Zenica Chatman onto the podcast today. She is a certified personal and executive coach, helping women rediscover their inner strength and confidence in the aftermath of workplace related trauma. Her own journey into coaching and positive psychology began after being left emotionally broken by a pair of workplace bullies at the height of her marketing career. She went on a path to redefine her self-worth and what it means to be successful at work. And now as a coach, she's helped dozens of other women do the same. As a coach, she helps leaders develop their own unique leadership style and create work environments that are safe and equitable. She's also the creator of an eight week work detox program, Surviving Corporate, that helps women establish a healthy relationship with work and puts them back into the driver's seat of their careers. Welcome Zenica. I'm so excited to have you on the podcast.
Zenica Chatman [00:03:45] I'm so honored to be on the podcast. So excited.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:03:48] Well, I'd love to start our conversation by having you share a bit about your own self-worth journey.
Zenica Chatman [00:03:55] I think I probably say I'm still a little bit on the self-worth journey. I think it's constant work. But I'll say I think my journey as a young girl growing up in the South, I always had this thing, and it's interesting, I talk about it now with my mom, that I definitely experienced colorism growing up in the south. And so I feel I internalized very early that the girls who get ahead were either the pretty girls or the smart girls. And so I always felt I'm never going to be able to change the way I look, but I can definitely be smart. So that was going to be kind of my path to success. And so that put me on a journey of always wanting to be smart, always feeling I have to be smart because I don't have the pretty trait to fall back on.
And as I got older, that turned into box checking and achievements and where I worked and what I was doing and what company I was working for and whether or not I was lead on this project or that project, which of course you and I both know that is never a good path, that is not the place that you want to hang your self-worth hat on. And so, when I did start to encounter different ism and issues in the workplace, of course my self worth was wrecked, because if I'm not the successful one and I'm not the smart one, well then who am I? And so that was really when I started to peel back the layers in understanding if I don't have any of these things anymore. And then additionally in 2020 I was in a really bad car accident and I had a concussion and so I could not read. So imagine the smart girl also. So now it's gosh, you don't even have the ability to acquire knowledge anymore.
And so who am I without all of those things? What am I going to bring to the world if I no longer have achievements, if I no longer have my smarts, right? But I really went on a path to start to understand what is it that I want to bring to the world? What is my purpose? Why am I here? And that's when I learned that it wasn't necessarily about acquiring knowledge and sharing knowledge, but it was about how you impact people and how was I going to use all of these things and skills that I had acquired to really impact the world and in turn start to redefine my own self-worth and really get back to a place of, you know what, if I never read another book, I'm worthy, if I never achieve another thing, if I never check another box, if I just lay all of those things down, I am still worthy of love, of peace, of psychological safety at work. All the things, I'm still worthy of that even if I don't do anything else because my being is enough.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:06:53] That's so powerful and I think will resonate with a lot of people. I really appreciate how your story touches on how we can be really challenged around self-worth when we lose parts of our identity. Because I think that so often happens. It's like, okay, well this is my identity. I'm the smart one, I'm the high achiever. I'm the one who has the money. I'm the one who has the partner. I'm the one who has the… right? These sort of roles and identities. And we decide, well we're worthy because we have these things. And then when we lose those roles, like if you leave a job or you lose a job or you lose the ability to read or whatever it is, right? Sometimes it's your body changes. There's lots of things. And then that sort of faces us with, do we no longer believe we're worthy? Because we no longer can identify as this person or in this role. And so that's what prompted you it sounds like to work through some of these deeper questions because you realize that you couldn't just rest on the achievements or the identity as a smart one when that was no longer available to you.
Zenica Chatman [00:08:08] Right. And you know this because you talk about this all the time in this space, it's just a trap too, right? I think that was when the veil of all of it was pulled away from me. And it really kind of started me on this path of, it's a trap. It doesn't matter. The next degree is a trap. The bigger house is a trap, the promotion, it's all a trap. If you don't get clarity and clear and in love with who you are in this particular moment, you're going to be chasing all that other crap for the rest of your life.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:08:45] Yes, yes, yes. I tend to say the game is rigged, right? You trying to play this game and it keeps saying it's the next thing. It's the house, it's the car, it's the partner, it's the promotion, and you get there and you're ok, great, I can rest now I can feel good about myself, I can feel worthy. And it's oh, oh, no, it's actually that next thing over there. You got to keep running, you got to keep going. There's no breaks, right? And we can really exhaust ourselves in the process. I'm curious about, you talked about working really hard and doing all of these things because you felt like your work was dependent on these status and being the lead. What did life look and feel like for you when you were in that space and operating from that place?
Zenica Chatman [00:09:34] It felt very busy, but it felt very unfulfilled. I was doing all the things. I was on all the committees at work. And honestly, I have learned on this other side of it, that work is great, but I love doing stuff out in my community too. But none of that was on the plate, right? It was all work. There was very little family. There was, I can't come to this thing because I either have to work or I don't have the money. Which to look back on that now, it's to be overworked, underpaid and broke. That was not the move, right?
It was very busy, but it was very unfulfilled. It was very lonely existence too at some places, because oftentimes we go to work and we're friendly, but we don't really have friends there. And I wasn't really spending time. And when I kind of did an assessment at the end of a year, I realized that, man, I was really craving social. I had no social life. And we often think, well, that's a good thing, I’ll just work hard and the other stuff will come. No, you have to work at every aspect of your life. If you want to have a social life, if you want to have relationships, you have to work at them. And so my life became very busy. It became very work heavy. There was no work-life balance or unison or whatever cute words you want to put on it. It was just work. To me it was a miserable existence too.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:11:13] I'm imagining a lot of people listening could relate to that. I can certainly relate to that. I was definitely in the space of busy, busy, busy, busy, busy, busy, busy, right? Fill all of your time. And that can sort of serve as a cover for maybe if I'm busy, I'm purposeful, maybe if I'm busy, life is meaningful, maybe if I'm busy, I'm worthy, because I'm important and people need me and I have to do stuff and I'm so needed, right? We can sort of be a martyr for, I just have so much to do. I have so much on my plate, right? We can get into that type of mode. And for you it was work and nothing else. And for some people it's work plus your sorority, plus your church, plus your family and you're busy running around doing all this stuff for everyone else, but still feeling frustrated, resentful, right? Discontent on the inside. And so I think for those listening, check in with yourself, right?
Zenica Chatman [00:12:12] Absolutely.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:12:13] This is a tough but necessary question. Are you feeling fulfilled? Are you feeling like the work you do and how you show up in the world is meaningful? And if not, are you filling your life with a bunch of stuff that you think is going to make you feel worthy? But it's really just kind of for show, right? It's really just trying to play this rig game. It's another trap, right? As Zenica is saying, what's really going on? Because I think that can lead us to burnout when we just keep thinking I need to add stuff in. It's like when you're hungry, but all you keep doing is eating junk food. And then you're still hungry and you say, okay, well maybe I'll just do another bag of chips or another candy bar or another bag of chips or another candy bar or another energy drink.
And it's like, well, you're hungry, you need a meal, you need some protein and some good complex carbs and some fat, right? You need a meal. Some vegetables, not keep eating junk, but we can confuse the need for a true meal to slow down and stop and eat a nourishing meal, maybe with people that we love and connect to deeply with, okay, I just gotta keep eating the junk.
Zenica Chatman [00:13:24]: That's right. That's right.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:13:25] I just got to keep eating the chips and maybe that'll cold me over for 30 minutes but by the end of the day you feel kind of sick and too much and overly full but undernourished.
Zenica Chatman [00:13:36] That's right.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:13:37] We can do the same thing with our lives.
Zenica Chatman [00:13:41] Yep. For sure. And we like to kind of disguise the trap with things that everybody will think are okay, right? So when somebody says, hey, you want to come to the vineyard with me, me and the girls are doing the picnic thing, and no, I'm too busy. No, I don't have the money. No, the kids have something to do, because nobody's going to argue with you that you're not busy. Nobody's going to argue with you that the kids thing needs to be done. Nobody's going to argue with you that you don't have the money. So I got into a trap of conveniently saying those things, right? Even though I don't have kids, or I had another family commitment.
So I could continue to feed my own vicious cycle of, I'm too busy for fun. I'm too busy for the things that really are fulfilling for the girl time. Because that's important. And we oftentimes will say, well, that's not important. It goes all of the things that you need to make you feel nourished goes further and further and further down the list. And I see it all the time in my clients when they come to me and they are on the verge of burnout or they're in a toxic work situation. My favorite questions to ask is, when was the last time you had fun? And they're like, I don't even know what fun looks for me anymore.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:14:59] That's deep.
Zenica Chatman [00:15:00] That's big chunk of it, right? I don't even know what that, I have had clients say to me, I can't even comprehend the question because I don't even know what that means anymore.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:15:13]: Yeah. I've thought about this idea, which is that I think so often I'll say Black women in particular, and I'm sure it applies to other groups, but certainly Black women are socialized into this idea that are suffering is of service. And that that we're supposed to suffer and serve and be martyrs. We're supposed to support everyone else and other people can have fun, Black men can have fun. But we don't have room or time for fun. right? And we sort of then start to internalize this idea that we don't have time for fun. We don't play around. There's no time for that. You know what I mean? And it's really kind of heartbreaking, right? And it means it's even in that sort of the strong Black woman, which we know is a huge burden that so many Black women carry. And even in the Black girl magic piece, there's often a sense of you're magical, you're superhuman, you're not just having fun, right? And then when we do have fun, it's often sort of hypersexualized if it involves dancing or music and then often it's twisted as though it's in service of somebody else's fun or enjoyment or entertainment versus just being for us and what we enjoy.
Zenica Chatman [00:16:41] Yeah. Absolutely. And I see that a lot in my clients of just this burden of having to carry it all. And one of the things that I love to talk about in my coaching practice is, but you don't and I get a lot of flack for it, right? When I have younger women who are starting off and they're like, hey, somebody said something in my workplace and I feel like I need to address it and how do I, and I will say, do you want to address it? Because you get to choose which mantle you're going to pick up today. And is that one that you want to pick up, right? What pieces of that? Not everything at all times, right? Do you want to be on the committee this season?
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:17:25] Because Black women, we'll be expected to be on the committee without compensation, without acknowledgement, without consideration for your promotion. But you'll be working that committee. And improving that workplace. Because that's expected.
Zenica Chatman [00:17:40]: That is expected, right? That is unpaid labor that we do all the time. And we can talk about that a whole, another story for another day. But to me that's also the trap too in the workplace, that you're expected to be on the committee and save us. But the committee doesn't have resources, the committee doesn't have strategic oversight. So the opportunity that's being promised to you on the committee doesn't really exist.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:18:07] No. No.
Zenica Chatman [00:18:09] So you can be strategically raising your hand and volunteering for projects that are also going to help move the mission that you're trying to do, but also get you the coins and get you in the room to where you can actually make change.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:18:18] Yes. Right. That's a big difference. It makes me think of a job. I applied for a faculty position and they were so excited about how I was going to do this community outreach and I was going to help with their diversity. Because I had been doing some diversity work at my job that I was currently at, that I was applying from. And I remember asking them, so how are these types of activities considered for tenure? And they were like, it was 5%. And I was like, so I'm going to be doing all this work to make your department look good to do outreach in the community. That's a lot of work and it's work that I loved. But it's a lot of work. And that is not in consideration for my promotion or my longevity in this role.
Okay. I see you, right? And I think we can get caught up because there's so much affirmation of it, right? First of all there's expectation if you're Black you're going to be doing this work. . And second of all, there's a verbal affirmation without the deeper, you're going to get a promotion, you're going to get a raise, you're going to be included in leadership talks and conversations, right? So it's very, very surface level. And I think at the extreme it can be sort of abusive. Which also makes me think about your own story, that I wonder if you could share a little bit about your own experience being bullied. And experiencing a traumatic workplace. Because I think sometimes it's hard for people to recognize what that looks like, because we talk about abuse and we think, hitting, right? we think of this sort of, again, physical violence and I'm guessing that didn't happen to you, right?
Zenica Chatman [00:20:06] That did not happen to me.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:20:07] And there are different levels of abuse and trauma. And I think when people can hear a story of somebody who experienced it, then they may recognize in their own experience what may be similar and what may need to prompt them to shift, get out of that situation, address the situation, et cetera.
Zenica Chatman [00:20:28] Yeah. I experienced something at what I would consider to be the height of my career. I had landed what I thought was my dream job and everything was going well. It was a very intense job, but that's what I loved about it. Everything was going well. I had already had preliminary talks. So all the things that people tell you to do, having the preliminary talks around promotion and things like that. And I went into a meeting with my supervisor at the time and I thought we were getting ready to have the promotion conversation. So I had all my little documentation, all my numbers of here's how I am helping move this issue forward. And she just looked at me and this is without any warning, without any prior meetings. And she said to me, you're the worst person on the team. Now, that in and of itself, if I needed some feedback, I would think we could find a better way.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:21:22] A way better way. That's not helpful at all.
Zenica Chatman [00:21:23] Of saying that. And at the time, I was devastated. This was my dream job. This was a company that I thought I would be at forever. And here I am the weakest, worst person on the team. And after a minute to process that, she started to explain some things that I could do or, maybe I even asked, I don't remember specifically in that instance. And I said, okay, I won't play you guys after I went to the bathroom and cried, because that's something else we don't do at work. We don't cry. We don't let them see us in that position. I went home, it was a Friday night and I said, you know what? I am not going to let this company put me on an improvement plan. Because if you've been in the corporate world, you know what that means? Very few people come off it.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:22:13] It’s a rolled out.
Zenica Chatman [00:22:14] Very few people come off of a PIP. And that had come up in the conversation. So I said, you know what? I'm going to create my own improvement plan. And I went point for point with everything that she told me of ways that I could improve, how could I get support. I started buying courses off of Coursera so that I could improve in this area because I didn't want to ask the company. I wanted them to see that I was taking initiative to change these things to become a better employee. And I would love to tell you guys that when I presented that plan to her, she said, yes, let's do it.
Let's grow together. She looked at it and she looked back at me and she said, I don't think it requires all of this. And so that just kind of was a series of unfortunate events of where I started to get removed from projects. I was no longer invited to team meetings anymore. I had other colleagues calling me saying, hey, this other person is showing up to our project meeting. Why are they showing up? And I then had to either say, I don't know, or try to get information. So, workplace bullying is really when an employee is targeted by one or more employees. And yet that can be harassment. That can look a number of ways. It could be, denial of PTO. It could be not really giving you all of the work. So it could be work sabotage and not really giving you all the steps that you need to complete a project.
But it can also look very, not easy to track. So it could be that person who says one thing to your face, but says another to a manager or says another to your colleagues. And so you're always kind of having to address these other things. And so that was a lot of what I went through when I was going through my workplace experience. And as you guys can imagine my backstory of being like, I am always the best. I am always the smartest person in the room. I'm always prepared. I wasn't prepared for that. I wasn't prepared for the constant series of attacks. And it got to the point where I remember I couldn't write emails and I am a writer, right? I'm a reader and I'm a writer. I'm a communicator at heart. And I'm not talking about in-depth emails. I'm talking about, hey colleague, I'm following up on a project, because I had been told so many times that I could not write.
Why was I speaking to people above my pay grade? If I wanted to talk to this particular project lead, I needed to send it to someone else for a review. And so I remember I had one friend, one friend in this whole department who I would, she was my backup and I would send her emails and I would say, hey, would you read this email for me? And she finally looked at me one day and she said, I'm not going to read anymore emails for you and I'm not going to sit here and watch you, it's not okay what they're doing to you, but I'm not going to watch what you're doing to you. She looked at me and she said, you send that email and you finish your day and then we're going to go to lunch and this is going to be the end of it. And that was when I knew that I needed to get out of that situation and that had impacted me to a point where it could have caused permanent harm to me emotionally.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:25:35] It just sounds so painful, right?
Zenica Chatman [00:25:37] It was painful. It was painful. And there were days that, I sympathize with people because I remember the days of just mustering the courage to get out of the car and then press the button on the elevator, right? I was very depressed. I gained probably about 20 pounds because I wasn't eating, I wasn't sleeping. My hair was doing crazy stuff. And so it's just when people think about toxic workplaces and what that looks like and how that impacts people, it's not just about, happier employees are more productive, happier employees are happier people and you should just want happier people working at your companies.
You should not want to subject people to any type of leadership that makes them feel like they can't speak up and makes them feel like they can't trust their teammates and they can't trust their leadership. We have to stop praising these crazy leadership styles that belittle people and make them feel small. Because I've been a nerd a really long time and once I graduated college, I quit reading fiction books. I've read all the leadership books on the shelf and I've never read one that says, the way that you make an employee more productive is make them feel like crap. That's not good.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:27:07] No, that’s not helpful.
Zenica Chatman [00:27:08] It's good for the company, right? But we have so many people who are going through this and they can't get the support that they need from their leadership or from their companies.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:28:21] Well, and it sounds a big thing that happened was not only were they bullying you and using shame-based tactics and really just not giving you room, first of all, not giving you constructive feedback, not supporting your growth and development, right? Basically sort of by the time you got the feedback they had decided that they didn't think you were a good team member or whatever. So they were sort of how do we get her out, right? And that seems it was a very unfair assessment. And then for you, because you were in achiever mode, you took it on as a challenge.
Zenica Chatman [00:29:00] Absolutely.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:29:01] And you said, okay, how do I fix it? How do I prove them wrong? I'm just always going to be working. I'm always going to break. I'm just, this is what I do, I know how to do, right? And so then it became an internalized, and I think that's what you're saying, your work friend was like, you got to stop doing this to yourself, because for you it felt they just don't see, you know what I mean? I've got to show them I can do this. And that was then an extra layer on top of the abuse that you were experiencing from them.
Zenica Chatman [00:29:37] Yeah. Yep. That's exactly, You hit the nail on the head. Yeah.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:29:41] Yeah. What role do you feel race and gender, right? Being a Black woman played in that whole situation?
Zenica Chatman [00:29:51] I think it played a huge part. By the time I started to experience what I was experiencing, I had a few other friends of color who were in that role and one of them called me one day. We hadn't spoken in a really long time, and she started asking me questions. She said, hey, has anybody done this yet? Has anybody said this to you yet? Have these things come up yet? And as I was talking to her, I was having this moment of, how does she know? How does she know what's happening? What kinds of things are going on? And she's been removed from this place for months at this point. And so I definitely think that race played a huge factor. I think that on some level the toxicity was just there. But I definitely think that the level of just aggressiveness that I felt definitely was because of my race, was because I was a Black woman. I think that had I not been, if I still had issues that needed to be addressed, I think the comments would've been tempered a different way. But I think that, because I was a woman of color and I think that they knew that there would be no repercussions, is that whatever they wanted to say, they treated me however they wanted to treat me.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:31:13] Tell me about how you got out of that situation and how you healed or recovered from it.
Zenica Chatman [00:31:21] Yeah, so I will say I got out by the grace of God and I recognize how lucky I was because as I study more about workplace bullying, as I work with more and more people, I understand that my situation was very unique and that I had someone who was already looking out for me. And that same friend who told me, get yourself together, was the same friend who started advocating for me in other areas of this particular company. And because of that, because she spoke up, not because I spoke up, I had gone to HR and HR told me a different thing, but it was because she spoke up that I was able to transition into a different role and get snatched out of that really quickly before it went a different way. But I recognize, and I do want to just say that I recognize how lucky I was because for most people, we talk about toxic workplace cultures from an emotional standpoint and a mental standpoint. But there is also a financial impact to this as well, because many people are not as fortunate as I am and they end up having to separate from a situation without another place of employment. And imagine for people right now on the other side of this pandemic, as we tether on the line of recession, what that could do to somebody's financial situation when they're forced to leave something as toxic as that without another opportunity.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:32:49] And I think especially if you're in the mode of it's me who's the problem, and you're just in this space of questioning your worthiness, even your worthiness to be treated well, it can really keep you stuck. My last role, there were some problematic things happening. It wasn't to the level of what you experienced, but there was one day I was meeting with my friend, we had brunch monthly and she was like this sounds abusive. She's also a psychologist. And I just started like, you're making me cry at brunch. I'm just whoa. And I think it's because it sort of struck this deep truth. And for me it was a lot of little like, which I think a lot of Black people experience, especially Black women like, when you're going to make us look good, we're going to put you out front, right?
If you're going to make us look good, we're going to use you, right? Put you in front of the board, put you in front of the people who donate, put you in front of, but when you're not in that space, we're going to ignore you. We're going to give you the worst office. We're not going to order you lunch and everybody else got lunch. You're the only one who didn't get lunch. And we're not going to even notice or acknowledge. We're going to be reductive about what your role is, right? And with this tension, right? Between like okay, you're putting me out front, right? Look, we got this Black woman. We're so impressive. But then it was, well your wellbeing, your comfort, right? We don't care about that.
And you also described this sort of mustering the courage. And I think that also is about is our bodies start to tell us that there is something wrong. Especially if we're ignoring things. And you said the weight, your hair, you are physically had to like oh, get yourself in. I think for me it was Friday evening I would be oh, so I could shut it down, feel good. I was not touching that email over the weekend. I took it off my phone over the weekend. I literally was like, disconnect. Monday it would be stress, tension, right? Most people call that the Sunday scaries. And I think we can sort of ignore, you're more irritable, your body doesn't feel good, you're tired. You have all these headaches, you have all these backaches, pay attention to your physical signs. And I think especially for Black women, we know about weathering, we know that our bodies age more quickly because of the racism and the sexism we're enduring. These stressors have really long-term consequences for us.
Zenica Chatman [00:35:47] Yes, they do.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:32:49] Right?
Zenica Chatman [00:35:47] Yes.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:35:50] It sounds like there are a lot of signs that you needed to get out. And I also think about my own experiences. I'm grateful it pushed me to leave and start working for myself. Because I needed a little push. And sometimes it feels like things are falling apart when really things are falling together. But in the moment it looks like everything I worked for is falling apart and what's going to happen. But in the long run, it's actually we needed to get out of there. And sometimes you needed it to be toxic, so you'd be like I'm leaving. Because if it was a little more comfortable, you'd stay.
Zenica Chatman [00:36:28] Oh yeah. For sure. I look back now and I needed that situation so that I could be here, because it freed me in a lot of ways. And not to get too spiritual, but I definitely had moments in that situation where I felt like, woo, if I didn't have a Bible or if I didn't have God, I would've fell completely apart because I could hear these whispers along the lines because there, I don't want to play people. There was a time when I had to stand up for myself and I felt like God went into that room with me and was like, all right, let's go. I've been building you up for this moment so that you can stand in your truth.
And in that moment, I had to let it all go, because I had so much of my identity and we talked about the achievement and I'm one of the few Black women in this group and I'm doing this. And I had so much of my own self-worth tied up into this job. And what these other people that I thought were so incredible thought of me, in that moment standing up for myself also meant I let it all go. And I had to walk out of that room and be like, whatever happened now is going to happen. I'm going to go home and have me a great Christmas and we'll reassess this in the new year. And even then coming back, it was just at that time of the new year and saying, I'm not going to do this anymore.
And I don't know what life might look like but I had already made the decision that I wasn't going to live like this anymore. I wasn't going to subject myself to this kind of treatment anymore. And it just so happened that in that surrender, other things started to happen. So I have this saying that I say all the time of, “Even when it looks like nothing's happening, something always happens.” And so for me it felt like, whew, I don't know what's going to happen, but this environment is not going to happen anymore. That something happened and somebody stepped in and said, hey, come over here and hang out with us and work for me. And so having that experience gave me the belief now that I have of even what it looks like things are falling apart, something happens. Somebody's got you. You just can't see it. So you keep doing what you're supposed to be doing and let the universe do its work.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:39:02] One of the things that's so important for healing from trauma is rewriting the narrative that was created. And I imagine that the narrative that you initially had around this traumatic experience was, it's my fault. I didn't do enough. I did something wrong. I could have done this differently, right? It was sort of a self-blaming narrative. And I'm curious about how you worked to shift that narrative and how you healed from that experience.
Zenica Chatman [00:39:39] One of the things that I love to tell people now because when my clients often come to me, they're just far removed. They're still in that, gosh, maybe I could have done something more. And I love to start with, what if you didn't do anything wrong? Right? What if you did the absolute best that you can do in that situation? Because sometimes we try to take on other people's stuff. And why are you taking on somebody who brought toxic energy into work every day? Why are you taking on their baggage? It's not yours to carry. So just let's move from a place of, but what if I didn't do anything wrong and just start there.
And then I had to acknowledge what happened to me. And it was not until I was having brunch too with a friend and we were laughing and joking. I was talking to her about this thing and I jokingly said, gosh, that person was just a bully. And it was a like a jolt went through my body of, is that something, do people really get bullied at work? Is that a thing? And I went, being the smart person, right? I had to research that. And I found out like, whoa, I’m not the only person that has experienced this. People really fully grown adults with fully grown adult responsibilities get bullied at work. So did I. It was embarrassing to think I'm a grown woman handling all these bills, doing grown woman stuff and I'm getting bullied because we equate bullying with what? A child on a playground who can't defend themselves. And I was embarrassed, I was guilty, I was hurt that none of my other colleagues came to my rescue. And so I also had to start with just acknowledging the feelings that I had around that. Acknowledging the fact that how I was treated, I was hurt by that.
Because oftentimes what do we do? We just accept that as a woman, as a Black woman, you just going to have to go through some stuff at the job. And that's just one of the things you have to go through. But no. You have to acknowledge that we go through stuff at the job and it hurts, man.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:41:54] Yes. Yes.
Zenica Chatman [00:41:58] And if we don't deal with that, we carry it into the next job. So now I'm looking at these other teammates like, so y'all ain't going to say nothing either, and manager, what you going to do? Am I going to have to start documenting you? And it's like, you got to give people a chance.
And we carry that from place to place. And so I didn't want to do that. I wanted to really sit in how I was feeling and I had to acknowledge that my confidence was still shot. Because the new job didn't heal me. We think getting out of a toxic work environment is just about getting the next job. No. That trauma moves with you. And so I had to go through my own process of, well how do I get my confidence back? How do I get the sparkle back? How do I bring the Black girl magic back? And that was a process. That was a process of acknowledging what happened to me, acknowledging my feelings, and rebuilding my confidence on a very regular basis.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:42:53] Yeah. I think that's really important, right? Because you can bring it into another job. You can bring it home, right?
Zenica Chatman [00:43:00] You can bring it home, absolutely.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:43:01] And frustrated with your kids, with your partner, with your other family members. So the acknowledging, the sitting in it, the offering ourself kindness is such an important part of the healing. And then I think you're right. It's like, how do you, one, build trust in yourself again, right? How do you reconnect to the truth of who you are? And remember that the truth of you is not what these other people said about you or how they treated you, right? But that it is that you can make a contribution and that you do have skills and that you do have intelligence, right? Sort of recentering what is true. And then also working to build trust with new colleagues, right? Like not assuming that they are the same as the other colleagues. Because the trap that we can fall into is you go into a new situation with the defensive energy. Now you want to be protective, but the defensive energy that then sort of recreates similar dynamics where they don't really trust you because you're always defensive and you're always like distance. And then there's no relationship. And so we can kind of then because we expect it and we feel we're protecting ourselves by expecting it to go poorly, then we recreate that dynamic in our next situation.
Zenica Chatman [00:44:21] Yep. And that's a big fear of so many people who come to me, they're terrified. They're like how do I make sure this doesn't happen in my next role? And we do exactly what you just said. One of the things that I like to encourage people to do is, you remember in the movie Mean Girls, they had the brag book, I like to tell people to start building your own brag book. And so that's one of the ways that we rebuild that confidence because in the beginning I couldn't go from like, I had been in several months of being told I wasn't good at writing, I wasn't good at speaking. I didn't have good ideas. I couldn't wake up one morning and just be like, I'm a rockstar.
That just didn't work for me. I had to have some concrete evidence. So I went back to, even in that job when things were not going great, I still had colleagues, VPs sending me emails saying, hey, we really appreciate how you did this. This was great. Great job. And I would read over that every morning. And I would remind myself, no, that's who you're the girl who did that project. The girl who got that feedback, that is who you really are. And all the other stuff that's a lie. And I would just try as much as I could to just focus on this list. And every time I got more emails or even friends, like girl, I love your hair today. I like how you put that outfit together. It goes in the brag book.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:45:44] That's great. I love that as a great strategy for people who are listening. It's also something that really helps to overcome imposter syndrome because you were really acknowledging the affirmations that you're getting. I also think this speaks to the power and the importance of working to embrace your unconditional self-worth. Because when you know you're worthy, then yes, it's going to be hurtful and disappointing if people say negative things about you and you'll still be able to hold onto the truth of who you are. You will continue to take care of yourself, right? It sort of guides you. And you can still take responsibility for the parts that are yours to take responsibility for and leave the rest. And so this practice of unconditional self worth means that, as you were saying in the beginning, right?
If you never accomplished anything again, you still know you're worthy of love, care, and respect. And so there's still a sense of, even if I'm not meeting their supposed standards for my work, this disrespectful treatment is not okay, right? And I'm worthy of more. And so that can just provide this foundation through which we can, I think more wholly enjoy life's ups and the celebrations and really embrace them instead of just rushing on to the next thing. And then also we have a cushion for the challenges so that we don't feel like we're hitting rock bottom and are struggling with a sense of who we are. Because somebody was harmful to us.
Zenica Chatman [00:47:20] Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:47:21] Awesome. Well this has just been a really powerful conversation and I think that a lot of people are going to relate to it, right? I think a lot of people are going to relate to being in the mode of trying to prove their worth through achievements of experiencing negative things in the workplace that put them down and sort of wondering how do you recover, how do you get out of that? And so I think it's really helpful that you're offering, one, your own story as well as strategies that you offer to your clients and the people that you coach on this. I know people are going to want to connect with you, learn more about the services you offer. So I'd love for you to share a little bit more about that.
Zenica Chatman [00:48:01] Yes, anybody who wants to connect with me, I would love to connect with you as well. So you can find me on LinkedIn, Zenica Chatman, Z-E-N-I-C-A C-H-A-T-M-A-N. And on Instagram at Z_Chatman. And you can also go to my website. All of my information is there about services and how I coach and all of the information is available there at zenicachatman.com.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:48:33] Awesome. Thank you, Zenica. It's been great to talk with you.
Zenica Chatman [00:48:36] Thank you so much for having me.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:48:37] Until next time.
Zenica Chatman [00:48:40] It's been great. Thank you so much.
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:48:44] You're welcome.
[cheerful music starts]
Dr. Adia Gooden [00:48:471] Thanks for joining me this week on the Unconditionally Worthy Podcast. Make sure to visit my website, dradiagooden.com and subscribe to the show on iTunes so you'll never miss an episode. You can also follow me on social media at Dr. Adia Gooden. If you loved the show, please leave a review on iTunes so we can continue to bring you amazing episodes. Lastly, if you found this episode helpful and know someone who might benefit from hearing it, please share it. Thanks for listening and see you next episode.
[cheerful music ends]
This episode was produced by Crys & Tiana and the music is by Wataboi.
Cali by Wataboi https://soundcloud.com/wataboi
Creative Commons — Attribution 3.0 Unported — CC BY-SA 3.0
Music promoted by FDL Music https://youtu.be/ZdQI7WQWi_g

Have you ever experienced bullying in your workplace? Is your company culture toxic and unsupportive?

In this episode, I welcome Zenica Chatman, a Certified Personal and Executive Coach who helps women rediscover their inner strength and confidence in the aftermath of workplace-related trauma.

Zenica herself has experienced bullying at work and was traumatized by it, but chose to embark on a path to redefine her own self-worth and what it means to be successful at work.

Listen in as Zenica and I talk about how to heal from workplace bullying and find confidence and strength in yourself again. We discuss the signs and signals you might be experiencing a toxic or traumatic work environment and the ways you can cope and maintain your truth, self-worth, and leadership through it all. Zenica also shares her personal story with workplace bullying, which is super relatable and powerful, so tune in and let’s get healing!

Zenica experienced colorism while growing up in the south and internalized very early on that the girls that got ahead were the pretty girls and the smart girls. Of course, that’s not true, but it led her down the path of chasing achievement after achievement. She lost sight of who she was at her core, without the smarts and the accomplishments.

When we lose parts of our identity, whether it be our brains, beauty, or ability, our sense of self-worth can be challenged… but it’s also an opportunity.

After an injury that landed her in the hospital, unable to work, Zenica was able to peel back the layers and see who she was without the brains and the beauty. She was then able to figure out how to feel fulfilled and in love with who she is in this moment, without all the achievements.

When we strive really hard to prove our worth at work, our career might feel like it’s all we have, yet it’s never enough to make us happy. “Work is great, but I love doing stuff out in my community, too,” Zenica says. “None of that was on the plate. It was all work, there was very little family, there was “I can’t come to this thing because…”.”

On top of that, when our workplace is not a healthy, supportive, positive environment, how can we possibly feel worthy of a fulfilling career? We’re not supposed to suffer through our career. We’re supposed to have time for fun, time for slowing down, and space to grow and expand.

What is workplace bullying?

Workplace bullying is when an employee is targeted by one or more employees. Workplace bullying can take a number of forms, including harassment, gossip, denial of PTO, work sabotage, or straight up saying one thing to your face and another to your boss.

Signs Your Workplace is Toxic:

You have to drag yourself to work each day.
You live for the weekends and it’s not until Friday that you feel like you can breathe and relax.
Your health and relationships are compromised because you’re overworked.
You feel like you’re walking on eggshells around your coworkers and can’t be your authentic self.
You only feel worthy of your job when you achieve a goal, get a promotion, or overwork yourself.
You go home with other people’s baggage.
You feel undervalued, alone, and like no one actually cares about or supports your success and growth.

How to Heal From Workplace Bullying:

Break the silence. While fear of retaliation is normal, keeping quiet only allows the cycle to continue. Find someone you trust, like a friend or coworker, and talk about what’s happening.
Acknowledge your feelings. Instead of suppressing your emotions, acknowledge and process them as you feel them. Speaking to a therapist or coach, if possible, is also a great way to process your thoughts and emotions.
Drop the big lie and focus on the facts. While bullies are skilled at undermining your value, it’s important that you separate their narrative from fact. “You are useless” is not a fact.
Focus on your truth. Once you have identified the “big lie”, start replacing it with truths you know about yourself, such as “I secured $6000 in sales last month”. This is essential to rebuilding your confidence.
Find allies. Relying on a trusted community to support you through workplace bullying is pivotal. Allies can support you in your decision to report the bullying or change teams/jobs.
BONUS: Instead of a Burn Book (like in Mean Girls), create a Brag Book that highlights all the accomplishments you’ve had, positive feedback you’ve received, and strengths you’ve developed.

Are you craving support in your self-worth journey? Join the next cohort of the Unconditionally Worthy Group Coaching Program starting on February 16th, 2023!

Apply now at https://www.unconditionallyworthy.com/program.

About Zenica Chatman (she/her):

Zenica Chatman is a certified personal and executive coach, helping women rediscover their inner strength and confidence in the aftermath of workplace related trauma.

Her own journey into coaching and positive psychology began after being left emotionally broken by a pair of workplace bullies at the height of her marketing career. She went on a path to redefine her own self worth and what it means to be successful at work and now as a coach she’s helped dozens of other women do the same.

As coach she helps leaders develop their own unique leadership style and create work environments that are safe and equitable.

She’s also the creator of an eight-week work detox program, Surviving Corporate, that helps women establish a healthy relationship with work and puts them back into the driver's seat of their careers.

To connect further with Zenica Chatman:

Visit her website: https://www.zenicachatman.com

Follow her on Instagram: https://instagram.com/z_chatman

Connect with her on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/zenica-chatman-86b50110

This episode was produced by Crys & Tiana.

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